EPISODE 6 OF THE MARKETING SOLUTIONS PODCAST: TIK TOK WHAT?
Sonya:
Today, I've got Sarah from Gilbert House here and we're talking all things Tik Tok. So we're changing it up a little bit today and it's going to be a casual conversation around this brand new Social media platform that all of the young, cool people seem to be flocking to. Thank you Sarah so much for joining me today. It's a bit of a weird episode.
Sarah:
Yeah, no, absolutely. I love that you've said, "Young, cool." Because I feel like that really speaks to you and I.
Sonya:
Yeah, we're definitely the cool kids. So a few weeks back, you and I actually went out to go collect some content for a client out in the Macedonian Ranges and at the end of the day with that down and we're like, "We need a steak sandwich." So we went and sat down and had some lunch and I've pulled out Tik Tok and I've gone, "Oh my God, have you seen this app? It has me so hooked." Because up until that point, everyone that I'd spoken to about it, including my partner, he was pretty much like, "What is this? This is so stupid. Why are you wasting your time on this?" And no one got it.
But I think you came in and looked at it from a very different point of view like I did from a marketing perspective where we're seeing this brand new Social media channel where watching how it's getting people sucked in and that addiction is happening so quickly for people. And I think the first thing you said to me, you were like, "Oh my gosh, look it's full screen experience. You don't even need an account to set up." All of these points that just make the barrier to entry for this app so, so low.
Sarah:
Yeah, absolutely. And I think, when you first brought it up, I initially thought... I was unsure about it. You always hear that there's a new Social media platform, everybody's jumping on it and that's a lot of the time, not the case. I think the last time that I really got behind, it was probably Facebook when I was at High school. But when you were showing me Tik Tok, I was like, "Oh yeah, I sort of get it." But then I realize it's like a reformatted version of Vine. And that's what got me hooked, that video platform that they got rid of a couple of years ago. It's back, it's called Tik Tok. It's full screen and it's cool.
Sonya:
Yeah. I was doing a little bit of Wikipedia research this morning and the interesting thing about that is that the parent company is Chinese, right? It's merged with Music.ly, Music.ly, like Bit.ly. And the funny thing is that the Chinese aren't actually allowed to use the app. They've got their own version of Tik Tok that's called something completely different. And the uptake with that has been absolutely massive. So what I suspect has happened is that there's been some sort of version that's been rolled out in China and someone in China has gone, "Oh great, let's take this to the world." But obviously it's a very different market with all the censorship that's happening with China and they've got their own apps, the government pretty much controls everything.
But interestingly, last year Tik Tok was downloaded more than 660 million times. That's insane. If you look at the downloads for that versus Facebook and Instagram, it has just absolutely skyrocketed. And I don't think we've actually seen an App be downloaded so rapidly. And interestingly enough, given the demographic... So I mean 66% of users are younger than 30 years old. It's actually more popular on Android than iOS or Apple systems. And it caught me thinking, are we old and uncool now that we use Apple iPhones rather than Android? Because you've got an iPhone, don't you?
Sarah:
I've got it. Yeah, no, I've got an iPhone and as someone that builds content as part of my work, I don't always carry a DSLR with me. So obviously everybody uses their phones to collect this content. But being on Android, those things have way better cameras than iPhones and they let you put SD cards in them. And the storage on them is unbelievable. There's so many more things about them that makes them more appealing to a wider audience because of their service. But I think maybe you and I, Sonya, because of our experience to Apple growing up, we're indoctrinated into the Apple system.
So it's really hard to move out of Apple because we've both got Apple computers and we've both got, everybody carries an Apple charger with them. Going into Android for our sort of group of people is a barrier to resistance. It's not what our peers are doing, so we're not, but perhaps for a younger generation they're like, "Oh I want the one with better services. I want the one with the better camera. I want the one that's waterproof," all that sort of stuff. They're picking the most logical option, not what their brand affiliation is to.
Sonya:
Yeah. I find that interesting because in my head I'm like, "Apple is life, Apple is everything." So looking at these stats-
Sarah:
Solid branding. Solid branding, they've stuck to their thing, you've had one for 15 years. Like...
Sonya:
Exactly. I'm not leaving. But I find it really interesting that obviously Apple have not managed to suck in those younger generations like they did with us. It's saying here, I've got a little page of stats because I'm type A, 80% of Tik Tok sessions are on Android devices. So-
Sarah:
That's huge.
Sonya:
Isn't it? It's absolutely massive. And I mean when you scroll through Tik Tok, everyone listening to this episode, I do recommend you go and check it out. I do have feelings, like I walk away from Tik Tok and I'm like, "Man, I'm old and man I'm unattractive." It just feels like it's full of these really good looking teenagers singing along to music and things.
Sarah:
Stop clicking on that content babe. It's serving you stuff from the algorithm. Just click on normal people, would say content.
Sonya:
No one wants to watch normal people.
Sarah:
I'm like, "I totally nailed that dance." That you see them all dancing and like Lip syncing and stuff. I'm like, "these are my people, I could do that." I am so unrhythmic, there is no chance I could do it. But watching it I'm like, "Yeah, I can dance it, it'll be fun. I'll be able to do it." Exactly and it's amazing. I've only had it for a few weeks, but I feel like I'm part of like this in crowd. Like I know Tik Tok music and Tik Tok dances and references and things. And the only person I have to talk to about it is you. But it's it... Isn't it amazing that it's just created this little cult? It's like these followers who feel like they're part of something bigger. And I think that's part of the reason why it's gone viral and why so many people are jumping on it.
Sarah:
Absolutely. I think that's so. Right now I was watching, you know the ABC news this morning and this is the ABC, this is not like, Mainstream TV, but they were talking about the song, Old Town Road, which I know from Tik Tok because everybody lip syncs and dance to it. But the guy... I looked it up. So old town roads, the song by the American rapper, Lil NAS X. And so this guy originally released it at the end of 2018, but then he gained popularity through Tik Tok and as a result he was signed to a record contract with Columbia and now it's been distributed as a single. He's got like Billy Ray Cyrus. He did the video clip I watched this morning was hilarious. But it's now broken Mariah Carey's record on the billboard charts top 100 sort of thing for like 17 consecutive weeks unbelievable. But he rose because of the Tik Tok groundswell of people lip syncing and dancing to his song like unbelievable.
Sonya:
It's just amazing. I think a lot of the time we do forget that what we buy as consumers and what we listened to and what we do, it's often influenced by that younger generation. So the 15 to 24 year olds are really setting the tone for what's popular in the market. And I remember learning about this at Uni and being like, "Oh yeah, whatever." Because at the time I was part of that demographic, I didn't see it. Now I'm on the outside of that. I'm like, "Oh man, I'm not young and cool anymore. What are the young cool kids doing? What's happening? And I see this so many opportunities within Tik Tok at the moment. It's not a platform that has been monetized yet. And I'm on there for market research of course. Sort of sitting back and watching and saying, "Okay, are any brands jumping on this?"
And what I'm seeing is that a lot of sporting teams are jumping on it. So obviously they've got basketball teams over in the U S I've got young fans, they'll do little videos. I haven't seen any Australian sporting teams jump on it. I have seen some police officers over U.S on it as well which I feel-
Sarah:
Yeah [inaudible 00:09:11].
Sonya:
Yeah, which I feel, those public service kind of roles, they're using it in a way that's really relevant to the platform. So it's not super staged and professional, but they are usually delivering a message like don't speed. And I think that's hitting the nail on the head, like they're reaching their demographic there. I'm also starting to see some product placements popping up and they're done in a way that even like the Instagram product placements. So obviously there's some regulations now around Instagram where you've got to actually disclose the fact that you are sponsored, on Tik Tok there's none of these rules. So it's young people with like a charcoal toothpaste for example. And I'll say this, charcoal toothpaste or makeup pop-up time and time and time again, whether this has been done intentionally by companies, I'm too jaded to think that it's not to believe... Like I'm too jaded. What am I trying to say? I would think I've been in this space long enough to know that that kind of thing does not happen by chance. It's not an accident.
Sarah:
People spend thousands of hours and millions of dollars to make it happen. They don't just happen, these products don't just happen to fall in, kids in Victoria's hands or kids in Iowa or New York's hands. These are sought after people, someone, some intern in some marketing companies spend a week looking for them. Like it's not, you're right. The skepticism around product placement. And to that, I think one of the things that I notice about Tik Tok and advertising more generally across social is, people are leaning into the Kardashian model of marketing, right? So people talk about Kim Kardashian and what she actually famous for and what does that family actually do? They're the world's most successful marketers because they sell you stuff without you even knowing it most of the time they just happen to be carrying that bag using that toothpaste, washing their face, putting makeup on their eyes and you go... And they're not like, "Hey, check out this new makeup, this new lipstick." They just like, "I'm trying it, whatever, putting it on." And that's the advertisement. People will stalk you hard enough to find out what the product is and where they can buy it.
Sonya:
Absolutely. And I think that is the most powerful form of marketing, that sort of brand marketing. And I know there's a lot of conversations, especially in the Digital marketing space around everything needs to be trackable, right? What I find though of your like switching on an Ad or you have some sort of big offer and call-to-action, it almost cheapens the brand. Whereas if you are putting time into having content created and this content placement and product placement and brand marketing. People talk themselves into buying the product, it's just a matter of whether or not you are getting your product in front of the correct demographic. I heard last year, do you know the brand shoes of Prey?
Sarah:
I feel like I do. They like heels?
Sonya:
Yes, they're heels, but they're like customizable. So I'm pretty sure, obviously I'm not the target demographic. I'm currently an uug boots, but I have a feeling that the way it works, they're high end premium shoes, I'm talking $400 starting point and you pretty much make your own design online and they're shipped to you, right? So this company had spent an absolute fortune with an influencer who I think was sort of around the 21, 22 age mark and sort of put a lot of their marketing budget towards working with this influencer. And the click throughs to the website and the traffic they got from it was absolutely amazing. But do you know how many sales they got from it?
Sarah:
You're going to hear like a zero.
Sonya:
It was a one. So they got one sale. Yes. So the thing is they went back and of course being in a company and having a Marketing budget you've got to go back and review, "Okay, what went wrong? What went wrong? Was that a 21 year old does not have 400 plus dollars? Or the occasion to be wearing these kind of shoes?
Sarah:
Absolutely.
Sonya:
So, I think it comes down to, where is your target market? Do they have a need for your products? And that brings us back to should businesses be on Tik Tok? What's your opinion?
Sarah:
Look, the first thing that comes to my head is ethics, right? So I am concerned with an ethical overlay in technology as we move forward and considering the age demographic that are on Tik Tok, lot of them under 20 some of them in their early, like early teens, I mean like 13, 12 year olds. I worry about advertising they're children and advertising to children in that way. And we see more advertising messages before the age of 12 than our grandparents did in their lifetime, right? So I'm concerned about what's being sold to children and how? If it's on TV, if it's on print, if it's on other forms of traditional marketing, there's laws around it. Governments have laws, these platforms. It's more challenging to ascertain the level at which it's appropriate. Should you be marketing moderate to 13 year olds? No. Like it's not on, but is there that sort of gaps. So I think depending on your product, depending on the reach of your product, because this a global platform. I would see very little Australian content in Tik Tok, I think I see it every couple of hours maybe. But you know, if you've got an Australian based product that is only available in Australia, probably don't be on Tik Tok. I don't know who's going to see that. It's a global platform for sure.
Sonya:
Yeah, definitely. And I think it again comes back to who is your target audience and what is your products. So for me looking at it, I sort of go, "Okay, I think there is massive, massive opportunity here for cosmetics and any form of sort of self care products." So I'm really surprised at brand I have not seen jump on Tik Tok yet is HiSmile. Are you familiar with them?
Sarah:
They're the ones that give you the plates or they change your teeth with the white thing?
Sonya:
Yes. So it's like a cheap-
Sarah:
No idea.
Sonya:
It's like a cheap teeth whitening kit. So it was created by two guys, I think they're up on the Gold Coast or in Brisbane, like super young when they started the company in they've done a ton of work with influences. So they're a company that have had the Kardashians on board, right? I'm talking, they spend 20 plus million dollars a year on influences and in addition to that, I'm also seeing a ton of advertising from them as well, right? So their market is like young, beautiful people essentially. That's who they have in their Ads. So I can't believe that I have not seen them on Tik Tok yet. They're a global company. They've done a ton of work with influences. Where are they? Why aren't they jumping on board? Because I've seen some crappy charcoal toothpaste on there, that I've never heard of before. Where's HiSmile? I feel like they're missing a massive opportunity.
Sarah:
Like maybe, I don't know. Maybe they've saturated their market. Maybe they've got more business than they can manage me. Maybe like it may be comes back to cost in use. Maybe the people that are primarily using the platform don't have money for that product. But with the advent of things like after pay and being able to schedule out payments, maybe that leads into it. I don't know.
Sonya:
Yeah. And another point that I'm going to raise as well that is that Tik Tok actually doesn't have the ability to link out to an external website.
Sarah:
So it's more of a brand awareness than click to convert sort of thing.
Sonya:
Exactly. And I think that goes back to us digital marketers, we can't track who has actually clicked and gone to the website and then purchased from that. I guess you could offer some sort of discount code in the caption. The thing is with that though, like anything that looks spammy or like an Ad, because you've got such a tiny, you've got like what? Eight words or something to write as part of your caption. Then people would just keep swiping through. It's like Tinder, except instead of swiping horizontally you swipe vertically, right? So I think people take like not even a second to make a decision about whether or not they're going to sit there and watch that video. So my gut instinct is that if anything hints to a brand association or an Ad or anything along those lines, that people just won't watch it. I think that younger generation is a lot savvier than what we were sort of growing up with influences and things like that.
Sarah:
Yeah, and I agree and the things that I have noticed apart from maybe product placements a little bit harder to detect. But the things that look like Ads, something that's quite curated or something that looks like it's been a thoughtfully designed or filmed. I will immediately swipe past without a second thought to it because that is the creative content is to sell me something. And because it's such an organic platform, people have... Like kids are filming this on their iPhones and the Androids and stuff. They're not, no one's going into post production, nothing like that. So as soon as you see something that looks like it's been very well curated, I immediately swiped because like the rest of the internet, there's so much option and pleather of information out there for me to sort of swipe through that I don't have time for an Ad. I'd rather miss something that could have been good as opposed to sitting through something I know will suck. I just swipe I anything that looks like an Ad, immediately goes through.
Sonya:
Yeah, absolutely. And I think that it's starting to become applicable to most Social media nowadays. Something I'm really preaching to my clients is, "Just start getting your face in front of your Instagram stories and film a frequently asked question." It doesn't need to be all pretty and polished and put together because if it is, people aren't going to watch it. And I think again, it brings it back to, and I harp on about this constantly create content that is native to the platform. So create content that is designed and built and created for that platform. Don't film a video. Don't go and film an Instagram TV, for example. That's a vertical video. And then upload it to Tik Tok, it's not going to have the same effect. It's the same as, I don't know, creating a square graphic for Instagram and then trying to use it on LinkedIn. And then you've got all the space around it. People just switch off. They immediately go, "Oh, this is just content and it's just been pushed from another platform. I'm not interested."
Sarah:
And not only does the consumer, the viewer and audience realize that it doesn't fit right, but the algorithm inside whatever platform you're on realizes and it's like, "This stuff's not cool. No thanks not showing it." So not only will your audience not like it, but the platform recognizes and then sort of ranks you accordingly. So definitely create it to the platform that you're sending it out on otherwise forget it. Like it's not worth it.
Sonya:
Yeah, absolutely. So I think a verdict then is that if you are a local Australian business. Tik Tok is not a platform that you need to be thinking about just yet. Most of the user base is an India or the U.S. So 43% of all users are in India. And I'd say the rest of them, mainly would be the U S. I know I have seen a few in Australia, in Australia like you mentioned. But yeah, I honestly wouldn't bother just yet. But do go and check it out. You don't need to create an account. You can just download the App and start having a look. And especially if you are in sort of the cosmetics industry or you are targeting young people under the age of say 21. Just go and have a look at it for some research. It'll be interesting to see if it takes off in Australia. I've been asking a lot of young cool people recently whether or not they've even heard of it. And a lot of them have actually said no, but that said, I don't really know a lot of young people. Do you?
Sarah:
Look, I consider myself young and cool. You're as old as you feel. So look, I'm trying to get as many people as I can into it, because it's a great platform and their value proposition is, compared to now the other channels and social platforms out there, is quite unique in that as a marketer and as someone sort of with a background in psychology, video offers an immediate way to convey a vast amount of emotional and informational content, right? So marketers want to sell on emotion and it has the advantage of being able to create a shared experience. So one of the really cool things I have seen on Tik Tok is lots of things, lots of content on the platform can traverse language barriers. So I've seen post some videos from the deaf community, people from non-English-speaking backgrounds because they're collaborating and interacting over lip syncing and dancing and content that doesn't require reading or anything like that or understanding the primary language in which it was filmed. But Tik Tok is great because it encourages people to participate. So you share, like, follow comment and I upload like other platforms, but something that Tik Tok offers is this thing called Duets. Have you seen the Duets?
Sonya:
Yeah. It's really interesting. You don't actually need someone's permission to do a duet with them. Is that right?
Sarah:
Yeah. You're right. And it's like this original content that say, you film at your house, if you're doing the lead in a song. And so me, whether I'm here on the other side of the world can film and put your video next to my video in the same post and we can do the duet and harmony together. So I'll fill in the harmony, you've the lead and we can sing it together. So it looks like, it just blows my mind and a lot of acting kids and drama kids seem to do it. So I lose so much time watching stuff like hashtag duet because it's engaging, it makes me feel a part of it. It's wicked, I love it. Like get around it. I love Tik Tok.
Sonya:
I know it's so addictive isn't it? And do you know what I love about is that there's no Ads yet. It's lighthearted. I feel like it's really going back to what Social media is designed for, to be social and bring people together and communities and people bonding over common interests and the in-jokes and it just does it so, so well. All right, so last thing I want you to do, Sarah, do you have screen time on your phone?
Sarah:
Let me see. Yep.
Sonya:
All right. I want you to go and tell me how much time you spent on Tik Tok in the last seven days. Tell me how much time have you spent on it?
Sarah:
Two hours and 59 minutes.
Sonya:
Oh, I'm pretty good. One hour and seven minutes. I've just had a look at my weekly total for the last seven days and I'm actually horrified, disgusted.
Sarah:
What did you get?
Sonya:
I actually don't even want to tell you. This is embarrassing. In the last seven days, I have spent 37 hours on my phone. Do you know what though, I feel like I play a lot of YouTube videos because when you close your phone, it turns off the sound like it stops it. That's my excuse. Anyway, so it's counting that.
Sarah:
You bet firefly. If don't have a TV and you watch all your Netflix on your phone, then it's fine.
Sonya:
Yeah, I know. I'm probably on Instagram while I'm watching Netflix on my computer. That same embarrassing thing. All right, let's wrap this up. Thank you so much for taking the time to join me today and bang on about Tik Tok with me. I think maybe we should check back in a couple of months time and see what the progression has been with this App and the uptake and whether or not we're seeing Ads and local businesses jump on it. If you are a local business listening to this, I wouldn't be worried about it just yet. I think we all have a tendency to go and jump on the newest, shiniest thing. I think in terms of effort involved versus return at the moment, not worthwhile. But if you're looking for some lighthearted entertainment, go download Tik Tok.
Hey guys, Sonya here. So my amazing tech guru and podcast editor, Nick, is a total legend and has some factual stuff around my convo with Sarah that I'm going to share with you. So we threw around some terms in this episode such as 4K. So let me just clarify that when we mentioned this 4k in phones only applies to video, it doesn't actually affect photo resolution. So for a lot of videos you see on social, like Facebook videos, often it's not a 4K video file that's been uploaded because they are massive. Now I know we totally bashed Android even though we feel some of the cameras are better on them than on the iPhone. But actually sitting down to do some research, there are only a handful of brands because they are camera superior to our beloved iPhone. Some of the top of my head are the Pixel 2 or higher Samsung S9 or Samsung Note. The iPhone 11 has me super excited though. I don't know if you'd seen any of the footage and the images going around, but it looks pretty epic with a fancy schmancy new camera. Thanks for listening guys until next time, see you.