EPISODE 63 OF THE MARKETING SOLUTIONS PODCAST: CAN HR BE POSITIVE?
Sonya:
We can all talk about how great we are at what we do, but consumers are a lot savvier these days and will often be a bit suspicious if someone is tooting their own horn too much. However, when someone else stands up and tells them how great we are, then people start to take notice. Welcome to the Boom Your Biz Podcast, a podcast for the movers, the shakers, and even bigger action takers in business. I'm your host, Sonya McIntyre-Reid, and each week I'll be exploring the question of what really makes businesses and organizations thrive. I'm on a mission to educate, empower, and inspire business owners and myself along the way.
Sonya:
(singing)
Sonya:
Today, I am joined by Jess from Positive HR. Jess is an absolute superpower when it comes to all things human resources. I know that doesn't sound like a very sexy subject, but it's such an important one as businesses are growing. In 2017, Jess received the LinkedIn Power Profile for Top 5 HR Professionals on LinkedIn in Australia, and I want to ask you a little bit more about that interview, Jess, that sounds amazing, and the Young Achiever Leadership Award. So Jess, welcome. Thank you so much for coming on the show. Just to let you know, guys, I am holed up in a cupboard in my holiday accommodation at the moment, and Jess has pulled over onto a side street to do this interview. So if you hear any funny noises, it's our unusual locations right now.
Jess:
Hi, Sonya. Thanks so much for having me on. Yes, we can talk a lot about the 2017 LinkedIn Power Profile, that's one of my biggest achievements. I'm very proud of that. And yes, funny enough, I'm actually pulled into a side street called Jessica Close, so pretty perfect.
Sonya:
I like it, it's meant to be. Jess, how did you start your business? What is Positive HR? Can you give us a little rundown on who you are, what you do, how you got started?
Jess:
Yeah, of course. Look, I think it's important to talk a little bit about my history, because it's shaped the way of who I am and how Positive HR started. I've come from a single parent family. My parents divorced when I was 13. That actually saw us to be homeless, and we lived out of our car for a few months before moving into a friend's living room. I'd been through quite a few, I guess, challenges from early on, and that really helped build resilience. And then when I was 16, I was actually told I would never be able to conceive a child as well. I'd always had these hope to have six children and be a child psychologist. So that was pretty devastating and disheartening. But both of those experiences I credit to what really shaped my resilience and my drive in life.
Jess:
Being raised by a single mom who worked quite literally 24/7 to be able to provide for us and save to get a house, watching everything she had to do to provide for us was inspiring. That's developed may of who I am today. She's definitely someone I look up to. Mum had 20 businesses, so you could say entrepreneurship runs in my blood. Mum and dad had 20 businesses. When I started university, I went into child psychology, and I then moved into HR and business, a double degree. I thought to myself, "Oh, one day I want to run my own company like mom. I want to be like mom and have both, have kids, have a company. I can do it. She's shown me that I can do it and achieve it."
Jess:
I went into HR management, I haven't looked back. I worked as a HR position in a multinational. And then when I was 25, I actually found out I was 20 weeks pregnant. So surprise, but a very happy surprise. Unfortunately though, my partner didn't want kids, so he picked up his bag and walked out, and that was the last time I saw him. I had quickly found myself at 25 a single mom. I had just been given an opportunity to be promoted to the HR manager position in this multinational, and I'm 20 weeks pregnant. So I'm sitting there going, "Oh my gosh, I can't do this. I can't do this."
Jess:
But then I think I woke up probably about two days later, and I went, "I can do this. My mum did this. I can do this too. I can look up to her for support and advice, and I can surround myself with people that will take me on this journey and will be positive about my experience and where I'm heading." And that's kind of how Positive HR was formed. I quite literally walked into the office the next day and said, "I'm actually resigning." They were quite shocked, as was all the employees. I resigned. I built a GoDaddy website that evening on my own, and within three months I was taking 10 grand each month. So it all happened pretty quickly.
Jess:
Originally it was a very original name of Jess Bilston Consulting. And then I knew I wanted to scale and grow, so I had a bit of a scotch with my friend, Nick, he now works for me as well, and I said, "What name suits me? What could I do?" And he said, "Well, you're a very positive person given how much you've gone through. I think we should call it Positive HR." And I went, "Oh, yeah, I like that. Let's let's do that." That night we're making Canva cards with Positive HR. We did the logo up ourselves in Canva. That's how Positive HR started. It's been a journey, but I live and breathe HR. I love HR. For anyone that knows me, I talk about HR 24/7. It's just evolved so much. Even in the three years I've been running Positive HR it has evolved so much, and it's exciting.
Jess:
Yes, it's not a sexy topic, but let's make it sexy. I remember when I went into the most international, one of the employees said, "Oh, you can't be HR, you're not wearing a suit." I said, "Now, I don't wear suits, I wear bright pink dresses. Is that okay?" He said, "Of course, it's fine, but I'm just surprised. Normally, HR sits in their office in a suit. Do you need to talk to me? Am I in trouble?" I said, "No, I just wanted to have a coffee and get to know you. Is that okay?" So going from that to, "Yes, I rock up. I'm about to go to a client today. It's a trade's client, and they're almost all men." I walk in in a bright pink dress with bright pink heels and it creates a bit of that bubbliness. I'm quite loud. It's shaking things up in the HR industry and changing that stereotype from, "Oh, HR are the fun police," to, "Okay, HR's actually here to support me. I've got a new perspective on HR. I'm going to talk to them." That's what we're here to achieve, and it's been good.
Sonya:
I mean, as I'm listening to you tell your story, so many things came up, but one thought that happened was that there was actually a study done, Jess, that examined all these entrepreneurs and people that were deemed to be successful. They found that for women that were class into that category, they had had something happen to them in their life that was a challenging situation that really helped build resilience. Whereas, they actually found that the opposite was true for men, that, the men that were successful typically had a very privileged upbringing and not much, I guess, what you call trauma occur. So, I find that very interesting, and I love hearing people's stories about what they think drives them, because I can completely relate to that. I think it's a situation where you've looked at it and used it as a driver, where there's a lot of people that would go, "These are my circumstances, and I'm not going to change them." So I think that's amazing.
Sonya:
I think the other thing that came up as well is that there's definitely this perceived, I guess, idea with a lot of people that HR is the enemy and don't trust HR. Everything about your branding, and I guess who you are as a person as well, is seeking to change that. I love it. I think it's very, very clever from a marketing point of view.
Jess:
Yeah. That's the thing is it is about shaking the fear out of individuals, because there is a fear and people get scared when they hear the word HR. I mean, look, there's a transition going from HR to people and culture at the moment that is definitely transforming. A lot of people are referring to it as people and culture. I think no matter whether you use HR or people and culture, individuals still have that same sense of fear. It's about educating what HR is. I know you asked at the start, "What is HR?" HR is about transforming workplaces, and it's quite simple. It's about transforming workplaces and the people within them. And that's how I like to describe it, because COVID has really expediated that shift in HR, and we're now seen as a necessity position in the business. We are very influential, because business owners come to us for advice or CEOs and the employees come to us for advice. So we are the middleman that can actually influence. We can take opportunities and make change. That's what's exciting about HR.
Jess:
But the only way we can achieve that is educating that to employees and to business owners. We are not here to hire and fire. We are here to transform workplaces and people. One of the big things, I wrote a blog on it, is in COVID, I ran 40 workshops on mental health and wellbeing. Now, pre COVID, I ran three.
Sonya:
Wow.
Jess:
And that again shows as HR, we are shifting mindsets of business owners and employees, and we're showing them that we have to take mental health and wellbeing seriously. I have never strategized as much as I did, during and even now, if we can call it post COVID, analyzing positions in the business, analyzing people, identifying are people happy, are people motivated? What does that look like, reviewing the strengths in the business. I think gone are the days where HR are people that sit there and they quite literally do the hiring, firing, and remuneration. HR is sales. It is challenging business owners. It is challenging and driving employees. And it's even challenging technology these days. How can we get the best and the most use out of technology? How can we use that to drive business success but still keeping employees aligned to the mission and values? So it is really a transformational piece rather than that administrative, push a button, hire or fire.
Sonya:
Yes, I love that. I think in so many different areas of business now, people are looking at every area a lot more holistically rather than, "This is set scope of works, and this is it." Can we talk about, for a second, how you went from starting a company overnight to doing $10,000 a month within three months at the age of 25 while you were pregnant? How?
Jess:
I'm a communicator. I love communicating. I love having conversations. I love sharing knowledge and talking to different people. And that's as simple as it is. I put the logo up. I had a very small Instagram. I wasn't really into Instagram or technology back then. A lot of it was calling. And I remember my first client, I'm sure they won't mind me sharing their name, was Tiamo Restaurant in Carlton.
Sonya:
I know that one, yes.
Jess:
Yeah, absolutely beautiful. I called Fab and I said, "Fab, I love your restaurant, I love your pasta, and I love your people. But I reckon I can do more. I'm in HR now, let's talk." He turned around and said, "Oh, well, that's a very forward conversation. Okay. Okay, let's talk. That's very Italian, very direct. Let's have a conversation."
Jess:
I went down, we had a pasta and a wine, and I spoke to him, and I said, "Look, I have no idea how I'm going to price my business yet. I haven't even got that far. I have not put much thought into it, but I know that I want to work with you. Are you going to put your trust into me so that I can then support your people and the business?" He turned around and said, "Okay, let's do it." That was my first client. I then, obviously, put some thought into my pricing and my packages and went back to him and said, "Well, this is what I'm offering." And he said, "Oh, okay. All right, that's high." I said, "Well, you know I have been the Top 5 HR Professionals and I do have the knowledge and the skills." And so he turned around and said, "Yes, great." We signed him up, and from there he referred me to another client and that client to another. And still to this day, we take approximately 60 to 70,000 a month now, and it's all referral still. Apologies.
Sonya:
That is absolutely fantastic. Do you know what? I love women told me about numbers and money in business. I think it's so inspiring to other people to actually go, "Right, look what I can achieve. If I have the guts to actually reach out to a business I want to work with, this is what can happen." Because I think a lot of people get quite shy and timid, and they're too scared to do that outreach. When you are just starting out in business, you do not have money for advertising. That's how you need to be building those relationships.
Jess:
Absolutely, and I think it's important. I have some people say, "Why do you share how much your business takes?" For me, it's not about saying, "Oh, yay, look how much I'm taking." For me, it's about normalizing the conversation, exactly like you've said. We should be comfortable in sharing, "I've come from this to this. This is my journey. This is how I've done that, and you can do that too." I'm not a business coach by any means, and I'm definitely not an accountant like the incredible Katie from Propeller, but I have worked with enough businesses to understand how in small changes what they can do to go from 10,000 to 60 or 70,000. It is achievable. Don't get me wrong, it takes hard work. It takes a lot of hard work, a lot of late nights. It doesn't happen overnight. Obviously, the 10,000 did. But to get from there and to actually grow, that does take a lot of work.
Jess:
When we look at referrals, I'm lucky that I enjoy speaking to people, and I'm quite organic at that approach. It's not going in to say, "Hey, I want your business." A lot of the time now, it's going into say, "Hi, I've seen your business. I love what you're about. I would like to know more about how you got to where you are today." It's not even actually even mentioning HR. It's not mentioning anything to do with that. It's focusing on them and their business, and then seeing if there's an alignment. If there's an alignment and I think, "Okay, my strategies can support your people to drive the business further, then let's have a conversation from there." But most of the time, it's really just a conversation to get to know somebody.
Sonya:
And then they don't feel like they're being sold, and then it opens up the conversation for them to turn around and go, "Hey, what are you do?" They've already got that trust, I guess, built. Just quickly, Jess, before we wrap this up, can you tell me about that LinkedIn achievement? How did that come about, and what do you do on LinkedIn to get an achievement like that?
Jess:
Look, full transparency, I'm not as active anymore as I should be, business gets in the way. But in 2017 or 2016 through to 2019, I was extremely active. I wouldn't actually connect with anybody I hadn't a met. If someone wanted to connect with me, I would say to them, "I'm happy to meet you for coffee, and then we can connect." And yes, that took a lot of time, but I would do it in my lunch breaks. Or if I was out in the road and I was stopping for a coffee, I would say, "I'm going to be here at 10:00 AM. You can make me then if you like." Sometimes I'd have three or four people turn up, and we'd have a bit of a small group going on. It was quite fun, and we learned a lot.
Jess:
But that award is purely from engagement, activity, and connecting a community. That's why LinkedIn selects people. So it's actually driven by two-prong, it's statistics in the backend of LinkedIn to show how much engagement you're getting, how you're driving the community and supporting the community, what you're posting and what you're commenting on and how active you are. And then it's also about what activities you're doing outside of LinkedIn. They actually interviewed my manager at the time to find out what type of projects I was working on, what I was achieving, how I was supporting people above and beyond. And then they looked at my LinkedIn. So with LinkedIn, today it's all about video. Back then, it wasn't as much video, but I was doing video because, well, look, I think the camera loves me.
Sonya:
It does. It does.
Jess:
I was doing video because I like connecting face to face. It's, I think, the Italian way. I was raised by Italians where you look someone in the eye when you're speaking to them and you have that conversation. I enjoyed being on camera to really talk to my audience. One of my first posts in 2017 was actually about the F word and swear words in the workplace. It was shaking things up a little. It was quite conflicting. A lot of people did agree. A lot of people didn't agree. But it was talking about something that was almost taboo, "Oh, HR can't say that we can swear in the workplace." But it was shaking up the industry. That really set off my engagement.
Jess:
And from there, I just kept posting on various topics that perhaps I took a little bit of a different approach to. With recruitment, I don't believe in panel interviews to begin with. I believe in really informal conversations. A lot of my clients, our recruitment process now is that they go and have a coffee first. That's because interviewing is scary. When we look at millennials and people that are coming into the workforce, they have not been educated on how to interview. They do not have that support through university, unfortunately. If we throw them straight into an interview with three people, of course, they're not going to perform well. But if we take them for a coffee and we get to know them, then we're getting more out of them. We're seeing their strengths. We're understanding how are they going to fit into our business, are they what we're looking for from a skill perspective and a personality perspective.
Jess:
That's really the award and how I achieved it, was shaking the industry up, making change, talking about how HR being that transformation piece, not administrative, hit the button to pay you. Even to this day, people bring it up. Like I said at the start, it is truly one of my greatest achievements because I worked really hard to engage a community and to show them that HR can be done differently.
Sonya:
I love that. I think you've made a really, really good point here about social media in general, that social media amplifies what you're already doing. And building those connections offline is really, really important because then those people that you are then connected with will support you online as well, which helps you reach more people. So, it does all come down to relationships, I think, with social media and having success on it. Jess, this has been so valuable. I love the concept of going and having a coffee with someone first. I've been trying to hire someone in the last few weeks, and that's something that I have been doing. Because I agree, you sit in a boardroom with someone and it's all stiff and formal and you both feel uncomfortable, and you don't really get to know the person. So I love that tip. If anyone wants to know more about you and your business and perhaps engage your services, Jess, where can they find you?
Jess:
They can find me at positivehr.com.au, which will link to Instagram, which is positivehr_ and then Positive HR on Facebook.
Sonya:
Beautiful, Jess, thank you so much for your time, really appreciate it.
Jess:
Thank you so much, and good luck with your hiring.
Jess:
(singing)